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Saturday, 03/24/2012, 08:35 am

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The TRT Debate | Studies Show Repeated Head Trauma Results In Low Testosterone


The Testosterone Replacement Therapy (TRT) debate is one that has been raging on for months, possibly years.

Chael Sonnen was suspended for elevated testosterone levels, Nate Marquardt was fired for his use of TRT, Dan Henderson is a TRT advocate and recently “Rampage” Jackson has admitted use.

Many chalk it up as past steroid users who have damaged their ability to produce natural testosterone and as a result now require the treatment.

MMAFighting.com’s Mike Chiappetta took a different look at the developing problem and in his report brought forth evidence showing that head trauma due to fighting can cause pituitary damage and lower the body’s ability to produce natural testosterone.

Fighters get hit in the head and studies are now showing that repeated blows can also cause this damage. So while it’s easy to point the finger at TRT users as cheats or steroid users who are now suffering the consequences of their prior decisions this new take on the epidemic at least gives TRT’s detractors some food for thought.

Here is an excerpt from Mike’s story:

 

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According to Catlin along with many other critics, the possibility of professional athletes in their 30s needing TRT is so low, it’s almost completely zero.

But new research might show those long-held beliefs to be incorrect.

The science of brain injury is still relatively new, and developing rapidly. In 2007, a paper published in the Journal of Athletic Training reported the first known connection between mild concussions and hypopituitarism, a deficiency that can lead to low testosterone.

That research, along with how traumatic brain injuries impact the pituitary gland, is being continued by Dr. Daniel F. Kelly, the director of the Brain Center and Pituitary Disorders Program at the John Wayne Cancer Institute at Saint John’s Health Center in Santa Monica, California.

Kelly is currently in the midst of a study of 75 former NFL players that is expected to be published around the end of 2012. In an interview with MMA Fighting, Kelly said that preliminary data from the study suggests that pituitary damage is occurring in a subset of the retirees.

That study seems to corroborate a 2006 finding in Turkey that found that head injuries incurred by pro kickboxers have resulted in damage to the pituitary gland.

Extrapolated to MMA, it’s not much of a leap to suggest that similar injuries can be occurring to this sport’s fighters, for whom getting hit in the head is a daily occurrence. In fact, Dr. Fahrettin Kelestimur, a professor of endocrinology at Erciyes University in Turkey who authored the 2006 study, told MMA Fighting that the most common damage has caused growth hormone deficiency and hypogonadism, respectively. The latter problem was the one cited by Chael Sonnen as the necessity of his TRT treatments during his appeal of a California state athletic commission suspension.

“These fighters are getting repeated insults to the head, sometimes more than concussive events,” Kelly said. “And if you did a careful analysis of those people, I’m sure you’d see a significant rate of pituitary gland dysfunction. That’s my prediction.”

The issue is complicated by the fact that it is not always possible to determine the cause of pituitary damage, according to Kelly. It’s well known that steroid abuse can also damage the pituitary gland, but head trauma can cause the same affect.

That makes things cloudier for regulators like Kizer and Lembo, who work for two of the sport’s leading commissions.

At the same time, they along with other regulators believe it’s important not to punish the athletes that come forward with a legitimate need by banning TRT outright. While the long-held belief that steroid use as the main cause of low testosterone among athletes might be true, it’s by no means a catch-all.

That knowledge simply just isn’t widespread. Most of the people interviewed for this story were unaware that pituitary damage could be caused by repeated blows to the head, as Kelly, the brain and pituitary expert agreed.

“Is that incrementally damaging the connection between the brain and pituitary? I think it probably is,” he said. “But can we prove that there’s an exposure component that’s incrementally adding up even if it’s not even considered a concussion. I think that’s probably the case.”

While MMA often points to its safety record, there are variables to the sport that cannot be controlled. Chief among them is what goes on in the gyms during training camp. While fighters who suffer knockout losses in competition are medically suspended in order to give them time to recover, those periods are rarely enforced. Some of them can’t be due to simple logistics.

If a fighter competes in Texas, for example, but calls Brazil home, there is no real way to check up on him and ensure he’s letting his brain recover from the trauma it received. Most good coaches will try to keep their athletes on the sidelines and away from head strikes in this critical recovery phase, but it’s not like that everywhere.

Take, for instance, Pat Barry’s recent explanation of why he hoped to visit Croatia soon to get in some training.

“Out there, you can punch and kick guys completely unconscious and they show up the next day,” he said. ” Whereas here, you can punch and kick some guys, and sometimes they don’t come back for the rest of the week.”

“Which is probably a good idea,” UFC president Dana White interjected.

Barry’s seeming insensitivity to head injuries might be ingrained in his mentality as a fighter who is trained to be fearless even in the heat of battle, but it also might be from an attitude that is generationally rooted, though changing. A recent Centers for Disease Control and Prevention report noted that emergency room visits for children and adolescents due to sports and recreation-related traumatic brain injuries were up 60 percent in the last decade. The organization’s director of the National Center for Injury Prevention and Control attributed to the rise not to increased incidences, but to growing awareness of the dangers caused by brain injuries.

Attention to the problem of brain injury has also been slow to come to pro sports. In 2008, the collaborative Center for the Study of Traumatic Encephalopathy was founded to study brain injury, and their work has changed the NFL’s outlook on concussions and head trauma, causing rule changes in 2009 that focused on player safety. This even though as a league, the NFL has had a multi-decade head start on MMA when it comes to head injuries. MMA commissions in some instances have only been sanctioning the sport for a year or two and are still drafting regulations.
As it stands now, most commissions have no tests in place that would determine this type of problem.

Only a handful of state commissions require an MRI in order to grant a fighter’s license, but MRI’s don’t always show the problem, anyway. A blood draw is more likely to determine if an issue exists, according to Kelly. Tests for luteinizing hormone (LH), follicle stimulating hormone (FSH), testosterone, growth hormone (GH) and IGF-1 (insulin-like growth factor 1) could serve as an effective screening tool to determine any pituitary damage.

Most of the blood work done through commissions prior to licensing though, is solely to test for contagious diseases.

A big problem when it comes to changing medical technology is cost. Ohio Athletic Commission executive director Bernie Profato likened it to medical issues in the world at large, recounting the story of how the son of a close friend died from a rare blood disease that doctors didn’t have the means to handle because of a lack of money to fund research.

“The more this stuff comes up, the more time medical people put into it, it extends our knowledge of it,” he said. “We’re regulators, not medical people. We do what we can to put these athletes in the safest environment.”

Only a handful of the regulators MMA Fighting spoke with had heard of the studies linking brain trauma with pituitary damage, but most acknowledged that such conditions are exactly why TRT TUE’s shouldn’t always be passed off as an attempt to fleece the system.

“It’s very rare, but there are some legitimate needs,” Lembo said. “My biggest concern is that most commissions don’t even test for these things in the first place so we’re over-penalizing the people that are coming forward and saying, ‘Hey, do whatever you want to me. Test me before and after the fight. Test me randomly. I need this, I’m on it and I’m going to be within normal limits.’ There are a lot of commissions who don’t believe in TUE’s for any reason, but why be hard on the ones coming forward?”

Dr. Kelly, who has been working on issues pertaining to the pituitary gland for nearly 20 years, in 2008 co-authored a study that concluded chronic hypopituitarism occurred in approximately 20 percent of patients who had suffered mild, moderate or traumatic brain injury.

With the repetitive head impacts from training and competing from month to month and year to year, it’s no wonder then that professional fighters could be subject to these same types of injuries. While finishing up his NFL research, Kelly is also interested in studying boxers and, possibly, mixed martial artists to gain a more definitive understanding of a problem that still remains mostly hidden away.

“I’m sure there’s a certain level of it going on,” he said. “I guess what’s really amazing, if you look at it another way, is how infrequently it occurs, and how sturdy the system is, how much damage it can take. The pituitary gland is this tiny little thing that’s less than a centimeter cubed. It’s sitting in a little, bony depression in the skull base and it’s getting banged around, and the connection is getting banged around repeatedly, yet it keeps it on ticking in most people. It’s a pretty resilient system, but only up to a point.”

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CHECK OUT THE FULL WRITE UP HERE!

Read More: Rampage Jackson (News), Athletes Who Use TRT, UFC

comments

131 Comments to The TRT Debate | Studies Show Repeated Head Trauma Results In Low Testosterone

  1. Mr.Rusk says:

    Shit storm incoming! Gggeeeettt ddddaaaaaaaaaaaooooowwwwwwswwwnnnnn!!!!!!!!!!

  2. John says:

    Who cares? Either way, you live with the consequences and move on. If you don’t want to fight with your natural low testosterone, then hang em up. You can still run a gym and train other fighters. Trying to turn the clock back 10 years is cheating, no matter how you look at it.

    Either fight clean, with your natural levels, or din’t fight at all.

    • zetoe666 says:

      Who the fuck are you?

    • Alex says:

      John you are so ignorant. Think a little about it. If we should follow your logic, then its cheating to get a hurt knee operated. You should just deal with the consequences of your choices. You are such a douche!!!

  3. Bla DeBla says:

    Are these juiced up faggots campaigning for the use of synthetic hormones or are they campaigning to get the sport banned because of the head trauma it causes ?

    If yer Testosterone levels are low its the sign of a brain injury is what he is saying & if you are showing signs of a brain injury no regulating sporting body is going to give you a licensee to fight unless you are in a developing country in the 3’rd world .

    If you cant compete naturally its time to retire , theres no shortage of younger fighters with no hormonal problems & no fighter is irreplaceable .

    Too many prison queers involved with this sport that like to see their imagined prison daddys steroided bodies performing “Fantasy” violent acts on each other .

    Its fucking sick .

    Compete naturally or fuck off faggots .

    • Matt says:

      Your being an idiot. It’s a sport and as long as the testosterone levels are acceptable and within the normal range they’re allowed to fight. If Hendo fights Jones and they both have regular testosterone levels that means that it’s the fairest fight for both of them. Jones fights at his best and so would Hendo even though he NEEDS TRT to be at within the normal range. It’s not cheating if no one has an advantage. Stop complaining and re read the science, idiot

      • Bla DeBla says:

        If I wanted to read science I’d go to a fucking science school but I dont so I wont .

        I want to see legitimate fights between grown men in their natural conditions competing for massive & deserved rewards , I dont wanna see you masturbating fantasizing about how some old guy who should have retired 5 or 10 years ago is beating the shit outa some young fella who you imagine to be the helpless you who is about be be prison raped .

        Shove yer science up yer hole faggot .

        Fact remains the so called report states that repeated head trauma causes low testosterone which indicates a brain injury which results in the pituitary gland , among others , releasing less of the hormones necessary for a man to be healthy .

        That is Brain Damage & any governing body that awards a brain damaged fighter a licensee to fight should first be sued for every penny its got & secondly taken out & lined up against a wall & then shot .

        Any sport governed by such a body can not be legalized & should not be legalized .

        • Matt says:

          So because a disease lowers a fighters testosterone levels you think it’s wrong that they use everything within the rules to be at the same level as everyone else? And yeah fuck that science school? Do you even go to school? You don’t need science to understand what was clearly explained above and what I have now twice clearly explained to you. Why should fighters not all be competing at the same level. Should we let sick people die? Not give welfare to idiots like you who do nothing, accomplish nothing? Call me a faggot cause name calling in a comment section makes you feel tough? If you want everything to be all natural go live in the woods by yourself and see how well you do. No computer to flame people actually living out they’re dreams and making something out of themselves. Your just spitting out opinions with no backing and assuming your right. Back up what your saying with facts not your own opinions and then comment back so I don’t embarrass you for a 4th time today.

        • Bla DeBla says:

          What disease ?

          Being punched in the head is not a disease it is a choice , these men have the choice to enter into a professional fight or not .

          And as for lowered levels of testosterone why are they being compared to a 25 year old athletes when the fighters in Question are all in their mid 30’s ?

          Shouldn’t they be compared to a medically healthy non athlete man of similar structure & age ?

          esides that it is all just a smoke screen so that perverts like you can fall in love with older men & make believe some sick violent homosexual fantasy .

          Being struck in the head & training to be struck in the hea is their choice , it is not a disease & if their levels of testosterone fall because of those choices it is no more a disease than a black eye is a disease because it results from being struck in the head also .

          So like I said before , or if I havent said it yet I do apologize …

          Fuck Off Faggot !

        • Matt says:

          I realize your having trouble with this and I actually have a life I’m busy with so this will be my last verbal beatdown towards you for now. “growth hormone deficiency and hypogonadism” are just two of the numerous diseases that can develop as a result of head trauma. You didn’t give one fact above once again and you really are making this too easy. Have you ever even been in a an argument in your life. Cause it’s not showing at all. You’re trying to offend me but you are actually losing badly and making yourself look mad and foolish in the process. If your not able to understand why these fighters use TRT to stay at the same level as everyone else then you really are confused. Should fighters not get surgery? GSP’s ACL should have gone unrepaired because that wouldn’t be natural. Maybe they should get rid of the octagon and gloves and fight in a field? You say they’re not natural even though they are at the natural levels come fight time? What does natural even mean to you. Because you seem to think anything man made like synthetic testosterone shouldn’t be allowed. If so should we even have houses or computer like the one your flaming pro athletes on? You don’t even know what natural means and you argue that TRT and maybe technology in general is bad. Technology that you use everyday? Stop contradicting your words and think before your next post. Don’t bother replying I’ve got things to do but feel free to start being a pussy ass flamer tomorrow and I’ll try and find time to smack you again. Idiot

        • Bla DeBla says:

          Head trauma in professional combat sports is Brain damage .

          What didnt you understand ?

          If a Brain Damaged fighter is licensed to fight & suffers irreparable damage then the governing body will be sued & disbanded & the sport it was governing will be banned because it is unsafe .

          Even if the fighter doesn’t receive irreparable damage & the report gets out he was showing symptoms of Brain Damage/Head Trauma the sport will be banned as being unsafe & poorly regulated .

          You are a fuckin moron …. A Stubborn Fagot Moron .

        • Donnybrook says:

          Matt by TKO… due to Cum DeSponge’s weak debating skills.

        • zetoe666 says:

          Where can I find a science school?

          Just stop br0. You’re an idiot.

        • Bla DeBla says:

          My previous link was removed so here ya go with instructions even you can follow …

          (http://www.ohsu.edu/xd/)

          1: Cut what is between the brackets, making sure to leave the brackets behind

          2: Paste what you cut into the address bar within a new browser page .

          3: Click send .

          Alternatively search google for “Oregon Health and Science University” & just follow yer nose .

        • K2 says:

          @Bla DeBla. Look! It’s a DOUCHE and a TROLL. It’s a TROLL’S DOUCHE!!

      • Joe Bidden says:

        The fact of the matter is that Hendo, Rampage, Sonnen, or whoever else WILL decline in the sport and WILL become unable to continue. It’s natural. It’s how it works. I understand that maybe Sonnen wouldn’t be able to perform as well without his TRT replacement and maybe he actually does have a legitimate testosterone problem.

        That still doesn’t mean it should be allowed. It’s natural for your body to decline, it’s age. You either deal with it or quit fighting. It’s as simple as that. If they want to be competitive, they need to find a way to stay competitive without having to try and rewind their clock.

        Bringing your testosterone levels to that of what a normal man of your age is fine. Bringing it up to that of someone in their physical prime? No, it’s cheating. You don’t naturally have levels of a 25 year old. THAT is the problem with TRT. They’re using it to bring it to levels of a younger athlete and that is by definition cheating.

        • GET RID OF FITCH (forever) says:

          There is no excuse in the world for what Sonnen did by shooting up enough JUICE toi jump over the moon for the A. Silva fight except the FACT he was CHEATING and he knew it gave him a huge advanatge being all JUICED up. Sonnen has CHEATED his way thru life in everything he has ever done and he should have been banned from MMA for having as much JUICE in him as he did. Obviously he committed another FEDERAL FELONY by obtaining large amounts of testosterone from an outside source which is a FELONYa nd his doctor should have immediately dropped him from TRT. The entire thing is shady as hell and Sonnen already being a FEDERALLY CONVICTED FELON and on probation or parole should have had to answer to FEDS on where he obtained HUGE amounts of testostrone which he shot up into his body with a needle illegally

    • Ninja Oreo Dollop says:

      If the fighter can’t take the damage to his body anymore he should retire but if they can take it they should keep fighting. Bernard Hopkins is in his late 40s oldest boxing title holder in the world and of all time. If he can do it so can these fighters. I’m sure he takes TRT being in his late forties and so did Randy Couture.

      Really this is a money problem. Boxers and Boxing in general is a much bigger sport and brings in more money. Because of that these boxers can retire sooner with a nice nest egg. MMA fighters can’t retire as soon as their boxing cousins but it’s getting to the point of where they can. In ten years MMA fighters will be able to retire in their mid to late 30s just like boxers.

      Look at the MMA fighters who have come clean about using TRT. Randy Couture, Hendo, Rampage, Chael Sonnen (Chael was most likely on the Steroids)… All three are old to very old as far as age for a boxer. I’m not saying that they don’t enjoy fighting at a late age but they have to stay in to make sure they can retire comfortably.

      I would like to let the fighters use TRT to stay competitive because their bodies can handle the damage of a man 6 or 7 years younger than him. There may not be a shortage of average-good fighters with normal hormone levels but there is a shortage of super talented fighters.

      • Bla DeBla says:

        You would like to buy the world a coke … then flop out yer motherly bosum then suckle all of them until they were content , is what yer sayin .

        Man up fer fuck sake .

        They are grown men & have made decisions in their life , if they cant retire on the contracts they chose to sign then let em go dig a fucking ditch .

        I’m not their mother & I didnt force them to get into the fight game .

        • Ninja Oreo Dollop says:

          I’m an orphan you FUCKING DICKWEED! Haha I’m just kidding you trolling tool bag of dicks.

          It’s not about being a man and making decisions. It’s about the progression of the sport and sticking around long enough to get a piece of the pie and make the money this sport could someday promise. These fighter’s won’t make that BIG payday like Bendo, Aldo, Jones and some of these other young fighters will get but if they stay that’s their choice isn’t it? No need for titties and coke to placate them. They’re fucking grown men if they want titty in the mouth they should get a pair, damn it!

        • Bla DeBla says:

          My point to you is why the fuck do you care if they get rich or not ?

          How does it benefit you ?

          I can appreciate you not wanting to see a fighter you respect going broke but I dont get your concern for their wealth .

          They are Adults who have made decisions just like the rest of us , only difference is they have had more lucky breaks along the way but they are only members of society no better than a man who digs a ditch for a living or a Doctor who cares for the ill .

          Keep it real fer fuck sake .

        • Ninja Oreo Dollop says:

          Their pocketbook doesn’t affect me at all as a fan of the sport but I do have favorite fighters who I would like to see taken care of after they retire. Being a fighter is expensive and making more money means they can retire sooner. If they can retire sooner in their mid to late 30s like they are supposed to then this TRT debate will probably go away. Unless these fighters are fighting for the glory of a championship.

          Fighters like Chris Cope (sad he’s at the beginning of his career), Wanderlei Silva and Matt Hughes should retire because their brains can’t take any more concussions. But these guys are staying in for the glory more so than the money.

          UFC brand name fighters and champs are making a couple million a year which is a lot to you and me, but not for the amount of damage taken in the long term.

        • Bla DeBla says:

          AGAIN !!! …

          I AM NOT THEIR MOTHER !

          YOU ARE NOT THEIR MOTHER !

          THEY MADE THE CHOICE !

          MAN UP YOU FUCKING WOMIN !!!

        • Ninja Oreo Dollop says:

          You certainly are acting like a woman now!

          I’m disturbed they let you have internet access in your padded room.

        • Bla DeBla says:

          Yer disturbed , no doubt about hat , now put yer floppy man boobs away & repeat after me ….

          “They Made The Choice !”

        • K2 says:

          Bla DeBla is a TROLL’S DOUCHE.

        • Bla DeBla says:

          Stuttering Asswipe ^^^

    • Ryan M says:

      You are a loser and your “Too many…each other” paragraph makes no sense. I hope you get raped by a TRT user.

    • baldy says:

      @bla de bla…not sure about the prison queer stuff, but, and i cant believe im saying this…i aggree. maybe low testosterone levels are a guys body telling him its time to slow down and move on (assuming they are just getting older or they have had head trauma causing their low testosterone levels) if their levels are low due to past steroid abuse…they can get lost. combat sports is no place for steroids, trt, or any other PEDs. its dangerous enough in there for those guys…
      or they could just start their own show. the RBFC (roid boy fighting championship) they can get as juiced up, roided out, and as freaky lookin as they want…might be kinda cool…big ole gorilla lookin motherfuckers just crushing each other…roid raging, rippin arms off…litterally. blood, guts, and shit all over…lol

      • Bla DeBla says:

        I have no problem with that no different than I have no problem with bare knuckle fighting but if its going to be televised it will have to be regulated so take your pick , its either an underground thing or its regulated & clean , you cant have both .

  4. Brett says:

    They just get it back up at normel levels why hate on it? you don’t bitch when your football players are all juiced up, it will only lead to good things and more exciting fighters i say let them do it.

    • Bla DeBla says:

      More exciting fighters ?

      More exciting unnaturally enhanced drug users , not fighters .

      I want to see men in their natural condition testing their metal against one another , I dont want what you call “Excitement”.

      What you want to see is a watered down public version of gay porn , not a fight .

      Some fights are exciting , some arent , thats the nature of fighting .

      If you cant appreciate a fight & fighters for what they are then fuck off back to yer gay porn sites or watch a Hollywood action movie or a kung fu movie because the Fight business has nothing for ya .

      • zetoe666 says:

        Sounds like you watch UFC, Gay Porn, Haywire, and Ip Man a little bit there buddy.

      • GET RID OF FITCH (forever) says:

        Hey Bla blah you just described Jon Fitch’s lay n pray style of leg humping which is not fighting. I think that makes twice we kind of agree on something in around about way. If all fights in UFC were half as boring as Fitch the UFC would have already folded up theri tent 10 years ago. something needs to be done about the Fitch’s of MMA. In college wrestling waht Fitch does is called stalling. I guess thast why Fitch SUCKEDa s a wrestler in college

        • jonesy says:

          it is pathetic how obsessed you are about fitch..seriously..i really liked fitch last 2 fights so shutup…bj fuct him up for 2 round ..then he got ko,,those were exiting fights…so keep on topic..u crazy weird freak…

        • GET RID OF FITCH (forever) says:

          Everyone I have ever talked to agrees that Fitch is the scurge of MMA and if all MMA was “fitching” it woulld done and over with. Fitch is hands down the most boring fighter in all MMA history and should not even be allowed in cage PERIOD

        • Bla DeBla says:

          Fitch is an excellent pressure fighter , very well rounded & strong in all areas ., Anti Fitch is either a clueless asswipe who needs to fuck of to Maui Thai or Kick Boxing or he is a Prison Queer who doesn’t want to see actual fights between evenly matched Sports Men he just wants to get a gayboy thrill from imagined violence , not the reality of Violence within a Combat SPORT .

        • Bla DeBla says:

          I described no such thing .

          Prison Queers like you are the scourge of MMA not excellent fighters like Jon Fitch .

          You have no interest or respect for the skill , discipline & preparation these fighters have & go through just to get into a fight .

          All you want to see is one helpless man get violently beaten by an unevenly matched opponent .

          That is not sport , its criminal in concept & it is blatantly homosexual because all men know that no matter what , two evenly matched opponents no matter what walk of life it is , are going to counteract each other .

          Only a faggot with no respect for the laws of nature would complain .

        • GET RID OF FITCH (forever) says:

          only skill Fitch has is LAY N PRAY. Kids jits is a joke. Hs too scared to ever lose position from his lay npray to go for a submisions. his stand up the worst in MMA, even worse than mayhem millers. Fitch will always be kniown as the most boring fighter to ever set foot in a cage. bla bl ah blah you are the biggest scumbag troll to ever be in this site and its only a matter of time beforre you are banned, You also have the LESS knowledge of MMA of anyone on this site. I can’t belive they let scumbags like you have internet access from Prison. we taxpayers actually pay for people like you to have internet access is an outrage. its obviosu by the way you talk you are being abused in prison. how does it feel to be somoens bitch there Bla blah blah

        • Bla DeBla says:

          Change the record Anti Fitch , yer crying about the man like yer his ex wife .

          A Joke is a joke but yer taking it way too far , change yer name , man up & be cool .

  5. Ninja Oreo Dollop says:

    Great read. Regardless of this doctors findings people are still gonna hate on TRT users even after his studying is finished. Not everyone is an abuser, there are legitimate damages to these athletes bodies.

    You can say these athletes need to leave the sport once they’re damaged goods but this is their livelihood. Especially since fighters are just now starting to get paid good money.

    I’m interested to see more of DR. Kelly’s findings on the effects of brain injuries in the NFL and future findings (when he starts the study) on the effects of brain injuries in Boxing. I bet Boxing is much, much worse than football and MMA. These studies could have a profound impact on these sports including MMA for the better or worse.

    GREAT READ I WANT MORE.

    • Thurgood Jenkins says:

      Try pubmed.gov. They have millions upon millions of medical articles, meta-analyses, control-group studies, etc. I’m sure there’s a great deal of info about low testosterone levels, and all that good stuff.

  6. jonesy says:

    yeah that funny i saw i thing on youtube with james toney talking about this exact thing in teh 90s…that is why toney went from ww all the way up to hw..they did cat scan and all that stuff showing toney was fuct from getting hit in teh head….

  7. Ryan M says:

    Bla DeBla, stop typing. Every time you type, you make an idiot of yourself. Where this “homosexual fantasy” thing comes from I have no idea. You are clearly a repressed homosexual yourself and haven’t admitted it to yourself yet. Don’t worry though, I’m not a hater like yourself and it’s ok. But seriously, stop typing.

    • Bla DeBla says:

      How so ?

      I’m not the one calling for drugged up enhanced bodies to make fights more “Exciting”

      Look in the mirror , the truth is staring you in the face you Prison Queer .

  8. DowhatIwhant says:

    Hmmmm. I am pretty sure Chael Sonnen got suspended for ‘Failure to Disclose.” Awesome fact checking though. Journalism at its finest!

    • K2 says:

      Not ‘failure to disclose’ but a 16:1 ratio of Testosterone to Estrogen. The normal is 1:1 the max allowed in UFC is 4:1.

      • Bla DeBla says:

        What were Silvas ratios for the same fight then ?

        Fucking hypocrites trying to use Sonnen as a scapegoat .

      • Bla DeBla says:

        Also are you trying to tell us that normal men have as much estrogen in their systems as they do testosterone ?

        If so where are our Breasts ?

        Youre a fucking muppet .

        • K2 says:


          Report of Sonnen’s piss test from the UCLA Olympic Analytical Lab. And I’m guessing Silva didn’t piss hot for steroids or such since he didn’t get suspended for it.

        • Bla DeBla says:

          He didnt get suspended because his test results werent disclosed because he isnt a “Designated” scapegoat at this time , it isnt in his contract see ?

          When Oh When will the penny ever drop for these guys ?

          The UFC is a cash cow for a Media company & all involved with it , it isnt a governing body sanctioning legitimate fights & as such its self regulated .

          Everything else is just a political sham , thinly disguised political favors & old school gangsterism .

        • GET RID OF FITCH (forever) says:

          FACT: Sonnen tested positive for anabolic steroids before and after the Silva fight. Hi testosterone levels were off the friggen charts plain and simple. Th e man cheated got caught and was suspended for a year. If you don’t belive me take 2 seconds time to google it yourself. IF and thats a BIG IF they make Sonnen come into the Silva fight with normal testosterone levels he will look as bad as he did in the Bisping fight. Regardless Sonnen is still able to train with massive amounts of testosetrone in his ssytem which allows a fighter to train at a much higher pace and recover much much faster than a natural fighter and it only takes about a week or two of tapering off to get his levels below 800 which is still double the amount of testostrone and average 35 year old male has. Only reason sonnen was even able to lay on Silva was because he had enough JUICE in him to jump over the damn moon. WE will all see a horrible beatdown come this summer and maybe if we are lucky Sonnen will just go away

        • Bla DeBla says:

          Yea Fitch , nobody is arguing that Sonnen hasnt paid for his mistakes & that certain scapegoating Prison Queers should get over it .

          The question I asked & has yet to be answered is were Sonnens levels lower than Silvas ?

          Answer that .

  9. not sure, HIV positive says:

    Wow there are a few people on here who really need to get a life.

  10. Trianglesrgay says:

    Random olympic style testing!

  11. Xaninho says:

    If a 35 year old fighter doesn’t have a large enough testosterone production in according to his age it’s not morally defendable if that fighter brings his levels back to the levels of a 25 year old athlete.
    If the same fighter would bring it back to the appropriate levels of a 35 year old it could be a treatment that should be allowed.

    So in short: 35 year old and using TRT to bring it back to a 35 year olds level could be reasonable fair. But bringing it back to a 25 year olds level is simply cheating and that shouldn’t be allowed.

    I think MMA should introduce random testing like cyclists have to undergo already. It’s still not enough to ban PED’s for a 100%, but there has been a lot more success catching cheaters this way. Cyclists can be tested at any time and any point. They have to be available for testing within a certain amount of time (not enough to flush the system) to get tested.

    • Bla DeBla says:

      Thats because Cycling has a rspectable world Governing body .

      MMA doesn not .

      The UFC Definitely does not .

      People need to accept that what happens in the UFC is Entertainment , at this time it is not Sport .

      It is no more real that the soap operas that your mother watches .

      MMA needs a World Governing Body the same as Boxing has , just hopefully less corrupt .

      The UFC is a cash cow for gangsters & crooked politicians , it is not the future of MMA , it is its past & its present .

      UFC = Entertainment + Make Believe

      Just like

      WWE = Entertainment + Make Believe

      Just Like

      Your Mothers Soap Operas = Entertainment + Make Believe .

      MMA Needs a World Governing Body sanctioning independent promotions then respectable country’s like Holland & respectable States like New York can & will legalize it .

      Until then , keep it real & accept it for what it is , excellent displays of Mixed Martial Arts & Excellent entertainment .

      • Jujitsu Player says:

        You fucking loser

        • Ryan M says:

          Because you are a repressed homosexual. Come out of the closet already. All you want to talk about is prison sex and men on men. Can’t we discuss fighting without bringing up being gay. It’s on your mind in almost every statement. You my friend are a gay. Not that there’s anything wrong with that.

  12. naru says:

    Debating back with, “it’s not natural” , “fight in their natural state” These frames must be used all around in life, not just in sports.

    Sure getting TRT isn’t natural. So isn’t brushing your teeth with toothpaste, or the beer that you drink, or the shampoo you use, or the vitamins you take and so one.

    STFU about it being “I want two natural fighters with just their abilities and nutrition”

    TRT is just a supplement. “Oh but you’re comparing TRT to protein powder”
    Ummm yeah cause you’re debating about being “natural” you can’t pick and choose. it’s all or nothing.

    • Bla DeBla says:

      How the fuck is deliberately introducing synthetic man made hormones created in a laboratory into your blood stream just so you can compete in a sport the same as eating food or the Macro + Micro nutrients derived from food ?

      You are so ignorant you seem to think nobody washed their hair with plant extracts before shampoo was mass marketed or that teeth weren’t brushed with apple juice & or salts among other things .

      You are a typical ignorant brain washed fool .

      Nobody here is complaining about the science of using hormone replacements for men in everyday life if there is a medical need , we are only pointing out that Fighters or any other athletes made the choice to try to compete , it isnt our fault that their bodys arent able to match their egos & delusions .

      If they want to use TRT , Steroids , Jungle Juice Voodoo or anything else then I have zero problem with that but if I’m going to pay to see what is being presented as a fair sporting contest I dont want one guy using a horseshoe inside one of his gloves & I dont want the other guy juiced up on synthetic hormones .

      I want to see a fair fight between the best fighters not the best “Guinea Pigs” who respond best to artificial man made hormones .

      Natural is the only way that is possible .

  13. Jujitsu Player says:

    For what it’s worth I think using TRT is cheating plain and simple and if you can’t compete at the top level without it then it’s time to quit. You can’t control it either because who sets the benchmark for acceptable use of it, everybody produces at different rates so it’s just prone to abuse.

    Also no shit getting punched and kicked in the head fucks you up, that’s why top guys get between $200k-$500k for 15-25 minutes work. It’s all about risk and reward.

    • Bla DeBla says:

      Youre a clueless cunt .

      1’stly the top guys get paid more than that .

      2’ndly its not for 15-25 minutes work that they are paid , they are paid for the 8 – 12 weeks of sacrifice of training , dieting & mental conditioning before the fight , they are paid for endangering their lives , they are paid for the time it will take them to recover from the fight , they are paid for the trauma they put their loved ones through , That & a whole lot more than an arrogant slime bag , parasitical , diseased English cunt like you could comprehend .

      • Jujitsu Player says:

        There you go again you fucking retard.

        1. Check your facts you fuckwit, bjpenn.com publishes fighters purses and that is excatly what they get paid as a per fight fee. So shut it cunt. I wasn’t talking endorsements.

        2. I was simply stating they get paid a shit load of money and they know the risks and the top fighters are well compensated for it.

        Your such a fucking retard, I’ve probably forgotten more about MMA than you’ll ever know. Stop infecting this siter with your bullshit verbal diarrhea and go get your school stuff ready for the morning. Tell you mum I’ll be round at 8pm so get sucked off, hopefully I’ll get to the front of the line this time.

        • Donnybrook says:

          Cum DeSponge is going to be pissed his mum is stealing tricks from him!… make sure to pull on her hair before hand, he’s probably going pose as his mum and dress in drag tonight.

        • Bla DeBla says:

          Oh Look ^^^ Its Donny with more of his Homosexual Fantasy’s .

        • Donnybrook says:

          Lame… ^^^ not even worth a reply.

        • Bla DeBla says:

          But yet & all you replied anyway ?

          Wat a fuckin idiot !

          I suppose I should congratulate you for posting something that wasn’t about shit or homosexual practices .

          Well done boy !

        • Jujitsu Player says:

          He usually just cowars and cries in the corner while we run a train through her. Pretty good footage of her on pornhub, bukkake section….

        • Donnybrook says:

          I don’t doubt that… he probably cleans her up after so he can get his fill.

        • Bla DeBla says:

          You musta forgotten all of it coz you know absolutely fuck all about it .

          What is disclosed & what is received are two complete different things as my good pall Mr. Ken Shamrock revealed , hence his question “why not open up the books so you can verify what you are claiming ?”

          Dont you keep up with the news ?

          Typical of “Yesterdays Men” (England) resting on history .

          Also quit mentioning my Mom , its just a smoke screen to try to prove you aren’t a fag & besides my mom would slap the shit outa you .

        • Ryan M says:

          Count how many times you mentioned being gay in your comments on this thread Bla. It’s you that talks about it all the time.

        • Bla DeBla says:

          Get over it & fuck off back to yer AIDS clinic you fuckin creep !

      • Jujitsu Player says:

        I just realized your fighting yourself, I read your bull shit comments and when you ignore 99% of the retarded shit you say you degenerate fuck you said 2 things:

        1)TRT is not natural.
        2) They made the choice.

        Which is what I said this just proves once again you’re a cunt who just attacks everyone’s posts just to get a rise. I’m guessing you’re the most hated person on BJ penn.com. I for one would like you to die a horrible excruitiating death. It would make me happy but not as happy as your mum makes me when her mouth is wrapped around my cock….that old whore knows how to blow….

        • Bla DeBla says:

          You are picking the peanuts outa my shit is what you are doing , you sewer dwelling English Vermin !

        • Jujitsu Player says:

          Just highlighting you’re not just a cunt but a bipolar cunt. Incidentally that’s your mums payments for the blowies she gives me. I just leave a steaming pile of shit on the table and she goes to town on it…

        • Bla DeBla says:

          English Vermin Shit on Their Dinner Tables eh ?

          Hardly news that .

        • Donnybrook says:

          I can’t believe your mum hasn’t eaten you yet if she’s a shit eater.

        • Bla DeBla says:

          Thats hardly news Donny , you think all kinds’a stupid shit .

        • Donnybrook says:

          Well its news to me Cum DeSponge… I didn’t know your mom was a shit eater.

          Think all kinds’ a stupid shit hey… seems you have that affect on people. You should be proud, after all that what your here for isn’t it??

        • Bla DeBla says:

          Dont be trying to blame me for your failings you soppy little weakling .

        • Donnybrook says:

          Not laying blame just speaking the truth Cum DeSponge. This is what you here for (you’ve never denied that) so just imagine it’s one of your tricks junk and suck it up buttercup.

        • Bla DeBla says:

          Yer obviously a sick sex pervert Donny .

        • Donnybrook says:

          No… not at all Cum DeSponge.

        • Bla DeBla says:

          He says , talking about mens ejaculate ….. again !

        • Donnybrook says:

          Fortunately for you everytime I say your name you will have that image in your head.

        • Bla DeBla says:

          Again you are trying to accuse me of your failings .

          I can assure you I will have no such image or remember a word you said beyond 5 minutes of replying to you .

          I actually fell kinda sorry for you because you dont seem to realize the damage you are doing to yerself because the reality is the image is in your head & that is why you are expressing it , the rest of us just kinda cringe at the thought of being as weak as you are .

        • Donnybrook says:

          You’re lying Cum DeSponge… you have the taste in your mouth most of the day so you must have the image as well

          No need to feel sorry for me because it doesn’t matter what anyone thinks about me here seeing as I personally don’t know anyone… besides it’s pretty obvious I’m just feeding the troll so you should be thankful shit head.

        • Bla DeBla says:

          The only thing thats pretty obvious is that you are a prideless demented faggot who is stalking me .

        • Donnybrook says:

          LOL, Your so predictable you witless shit stained cum rag… I knew you couldn’t help but reply. I guess I’ll just have to keep feeding you.

        • Bla DeBla says:

          You are feeding fuck all boy , you are stepping up & I’m beating you down & its as simple as that .

          You want to hold hands ?

          Fuck off to friends reunited .

        • Donnybrook says:

          As predictable as the sun sets and rises… your a smart one aren’t you, can’t really blame you I guess since you’re brain consists of shit. I keep feeding you and you keep taking it like a good little troll whore.

          Want some more??

        • Bla DeBla says:

          Yer bitch tits are showing like the pathetic weak little fag you are trying to desperately get the last word in an encounter with a strange man on the internet .

          You are fooling nobody Desperate-Donna .

        • Donnybrook says:

          “Pot calling the kettle black ^^^ , anyone ?”

          I see your not only shit stained cumbag but your a hypocritical one as well.

        • Bla DeBla says:

          Do you think everyone is blind ?

          Or is it that you genuinely are so caught up in yer ex wife syndrome that you dont even realize that I havent once posted in reply to any of your comments I have simply answered your posts to me on comments I have made .

          You are a deluded , obsessed homosexual stalker Desperate-Donna .

        • Donnybrook says:

          Still hungry hey… your a sad excuse for a cummed up piece of shit.

  14. drew says:

    very good article, for now if u wanna know if its a good choice i just say well would bj do this yes or no and why, and thats usually the best way

  15. Ninja Oreo Dollop says:

    This isn’t proof that Silva uses PEDs but, it raises interesting questions. It took me forever to find this btw someone should look at it.

    http://www.mixedmartialarts.com/news/291394/Items-purportedly-in-Silva-Cribs-background-not-as-implied/

    • Xaninho says:

      “Taraxatone is a legal diuretic.
      The pens in the image are for diabetics and not as implied for HGH.
      T-Bomb II is a legal supplement with multiple alleged effects.

      What exactly the threads are intended to accomplish is another question.”

      It’s probably Sonnen or one of his trolls trying to make Silva look bad.

      • Ninja Oreo Dollop says:

        It’s a bunch of dots not connected in any way but I thought it was interesting. I would like to know his testosterone levels since I read somewhere UFC allows 4:1 levels. Idk if that’s true.

  16. James says:

    I think it is pretty funny that Chael is on the picture for this article. Also, testosterone is not technically a steroid. Though I am not saying it is not performance enhancing. Bla debla seems like a super obvious troll to me. If he posts some inflammatory response to this calling me pussy, mommy boy, idiot, etc. then it is in the bag.

    • Bla DeBla says:

      You haven’t even read the comments you whiny little fag , you just read the moans & groans from the losers & decided it best for birds of a feather to flock together .

      Fucken Turkeys trying to hold down us Eagles eh Chael ?

      • James says:

        Busted! You mad?

        • Bla DeBla says:

          Busted wat ?

          Yer cheering for the losing side , what the hell would I be mad for ?

          If there wasn’t the likes of you I’d have no one to shit upon from up high as I soar .

          Eagles V Turkeys .

        • Donnybrook says:

          Bahahah!… the shit for brains homo just can’t help but reply… classic!

        • Bla DeBla says:

          Pot calling the kettle black ^^^ , anyone ?

          Fact is I have a duty of care towards this thread & I am closing it out as I do with every thread I decide to set up camp on & dictate the state of play .

          Its called Ring Generalship , Octagon Control & pure bad assness .

          Art Of War , & you are the example .

          Eagle !!!!

        • Donnybrook says:

          LOL… Fact is you’ve had your ass verbally kick by multiple people on this thread and now you’re tapping out due to strikes like a whinny little bitch.

          Eagle??… yeah right, your more like a vulture that goes for the asshole first on road kill.

        • Bla DeBla says:

          Dry yer eyes Donny , yer fooling nobody with yer pathetic girlish accusations .

        • Jujitsu Player says:

          If my verbal battle with Bla Bla was a MMA fight I would have won by TKO, pretty much like what would happen in real life.

          I bet $100 he starts posting under a different name because of the abuse he’s taking.

          The sad thing is, that night we all spent with his mother means technically we could be his father…It was the biggest cream pie I’ve ever seen I’m just glad I got in the first 20 because after that it got really messy….especially when the one guy turned up with a hamster an Alsatian dog and a Shetland pony…

        • Bla DeBla says:

          Look at the English coward talking about his pervrted gay fantasys about how he & all his gay boys beat me up with abuse on this thread then had sex with my mother ….

          How appropriate in a Gay site , sadly for you England , this is a MMA site & you are a fucking disgrace to not just the sport , common decency , all combat sports & Martial Arts , you are a fucking disgrace to the male of the species & living proof that the illegitimate gerrymandered political jurisdiction known as England on the island of ALBA should be nuked into oblivion , then all its diaspora interned wherever they may be until such time they can be either exterminated or deported to tha radiated wasteland of their former homeland until such time they die a slow & agonizing cancerous death befitting the suffering they have caused upon this earth .

        • Donnybrook says:

          Ouch… Poor shit head is probably chewing on some lead now that he knows the truth.

        • Bla DeBla says:

          Gayboy Tag Team ^^^

        • Donnybrook says:

          Proof you can have a child via sodomy. ^^^

        • Bla DeBla says:

          Proof homosexuality is a mental illness ^^^

        • Donnybrook says:

          Proof he has no life ^^^

        • Bla DeBla says:

          Proof homosexuality is a mental illness ^^^

        • Donnybrook says:

          Loves cock ^^^

      • Ninja Oreo Dollop says:

        “Fucken Turkeys trying to hold down us Eagles eh Chael ?”

        I’m not encouraging you to be a troll but this comment made me spit out my drink.

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