BJJ Pan-Ams and Mundials shouldn’t have belt divisions - like how Olympic Judo is run.
As you know, the BJJ Pan-American Championships and Mundials(world championships) have belt divisions. If a blue belt competes in the Mundials, they will tell him, “Since you are a blue belt, you do not have to go up against purple, brown, or black belts”. In other words, he is protected from fighting certain opponents based on the opponents having higher rank. If the blue belt Mundial competitor wins, then he is technically a “world champion” on paper. But in my opinion, he would not really be a true “world champion” in the strictest sense of the words. To me, the idea of a world champion means that you are the best in the world, regardless of belt rank. It means that you were not protected from fighting any opponent due to that opponent having more rank. In that sense, only the black belt world championship is a true world championship in the strictest sense of the words. In that division, a competitor is not “protected” from fighting any other competitor due to the other fighter having more rank. A blue belt world champion is “protected” from competing against other fighters based on the other competitor having more rank. To have a blue belt, purple belt, or brown belt world champion is, in a way, watering down the title of “world champion”. The same applies to the Pan-American Championships.
In Olympic judo, there are no belt rank divisions. A judoka who competes in Olympic judo must be willing to compete against any other player regardless of belt rank. Therefore, he is not “protected” from competing against another fighter based on the other fighter having more rank. A judo brown belt who qualifies for the Olympics must be willing to fight against judo black belts. Therefore, the judoka who wins the Olympics is really the best judo fighter in the world, not just in his belt division. He really is like a true world champion, in the that sense.
I think that in principle, the Mundials and BJJ Pan-Ams should be run the same way. They should either have only a black belt division, or have no belt rank divisions. That way, a competitor of the world championships is not “protected” from fighting any opponent based on the opponent having higher belt rank. It really would be a matter of “fighting anyone, anytime.” There would be no blue, purple, or brown belt world champions(which are titles that do not truly embody the concept of a “world champion”).
I realize that the practical consequences of running those tournaments that way would be negative. Far fewer people would compete, and that means the revenue would decrease. But in principle I think they should be run that way.
I would still favor having belt rank divisions for all the other tournaments.
Make sense?
In Olympic judo, there are no belt rank divisions. A judoka who competes in Olympic judo must be willing to compete against any other player regardless of belt rank. Therefore, he is not “protected” from competing against another fighter based on the other fighter having more rank. A judo brown belt who qualifies for the Olympics must be willing to fight against judo black belts. Therefore, the judoka who wins the Olympics is really the best judo fighter in the world, not just in his belt division. He really is like a true world champion, in the that sense.
I think that in principle, the Mundials and BJJ Pan-Ams should be run the same way. They should either have only a black belt division, or have no belt rank divisions. That way, a competitor of the world championships is not “protected” from fighting any opponent based on the opponent having higher belt rank. It really would be a matter of “fighting anyone, anytime.” There would be no blue, purple, or brown belt world champions(which are titles that do not truly embody the concept of a “world champion”).
I realize that the practical consequences of running those tournaments that way would be negative. Far fewer people would compete, and that means the revenue would decrease. But in principle I think they should be run that way.
I would still favor having belt rank divisions for all the other tournaments.
Make sense?
Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by Koonohiokala on -
yup.
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Permalink Reply by Tony Huckle on -
I disagree, if I worked all that time to achieve a blackbelt/brownbelt/purplebelt (i am a blue)i would be pissed if I turned up to a comp and had to fight a blue belt/ white belt. If you wanna mix it with the higher ranks work hard in training win your comps and wait untill ur instructor says you are ready, by jumping up ranks i believe it shows disrespect to all the work the higher rank has been through.
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Permalink Reply by Michael Quariadi on -
Tony Huckle said:I disagree, if I worked all that time to achieve a blackbelt/brownbelt/purplebelt (i am a blue)i would be pissed if I turned up to a comp and had to fight a blue belt/ white belt. If you wanna mix it with the higher ranks work hard in training win your comps and wait untill ur instructor says you are ready, by jumping up ranks i believe it shows disrespect to all the work the higher rank has been through.
Didn't you read the line in my mesage that said, "I would still favor having belt rank divisions for all the other tournaments"? My stance is that only the Pan-Ams and Mundials should be run like Olympic judo. The other less prestigious competitions should stay the same.
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Permalink Reply by Michael Quariadi on
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Now that I think about it, there are no belt divisions in the Abu Dhabi Submission Wrestling World Championships either. The BJJ World Championships should be run like the ADCC Submission World Championships in that regard, since these compeitions are meant to represent the most elite skill levels. Ditto for the Pan-Ams.
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Permalink Reply by Tony Huckle on
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i agree there is room for a comp were its only the elite but not in the mudials or pan-ams. Why take away the biggest competition for the competitors at a lower level
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Permalink Reply by Koonohiokala on
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Black belt, blue belt, brown belt, white belt... whatever belt... jus scrap! Leave the logistics to the masters.
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Permalink Reply by The Big T on -
I think BJJ should allow strikes in competitions. ......... Wait a minute then it's MMA Woot Woot.
I agree with you fully on this. If you have the inate ability to pretzle a Blackbelt as a white belt newbie and become world champ its the blackbelts problem they got caught.
By seperating them you remove the question of who is truely the best.
Maybe instead of wanting to change everything, Maybe they should just add a new no belt tourney into the fold of it all.
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Permalink Reply by Michael Quariadi on
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Tony Huckle said:i agree there is room for a comp were its only the elite but not in the mudials or pan-ams. Why take away the biggest competition for the competitors at a lower level
Another alternative would be to continue having the Mundials and Pan-Ams and running them the same way, but just calling them something different. Perhaps the "Grand Tournament of BJJ" or the "Gracie Barra Annual Championships". Any tournament which claims to be a "world" or "Pan-American" championship should not have belt divisions for non-black belts.
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Permalink Reply by Nova Uniao - Jess on -
do you realize how much money would be lost if they got rid of belt divisions? How many Blue Belts would pay $100 plus to get smoked by a Brown or Black Belt in there first match?
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Permalink Reply by kala alexander on -
Leave it. It's better to see the best at every level. Then everyone competes.
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Permalink Reply by Michael Quariadi on
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Nova Uniao - Jess said:
I agree with you that they would lose a lot of money if they did it that way. That's why I wrote,do you realize how much money would be lost if they got rid of belt divisions? How many Blue Belts would pay $100 plus to get smoked by a Brown or Black Belt in there first match?
"the practical consequences of running those tournaments that way would be negative"
"Far fewer people would compete"
"the revenue would decrease"
That's why I also wrote,
"in principle...they should be run that way"
"Any tournament which claims to be a 'world' or 'Pan-American' championship should not have belt divisions for non-black belts."(in principle)
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Permalink Reply by Geckoboy on -
I would disagree with that format that you outlined and here are some of my reasons. We know everyone starts as white belts for however long that just depends on your instructor. An example I will use you are just a regular blue belt who wants to compete with other blue belts who are at the same same skill level. Remember I said a regular blue belt nothing exceptional just a regular competitor. How fair would it be if you were matched up with a purple, brown or black belt? It would not be fair at all. There experiences would far out match your skill level. We often see in the black belt division were some black belts just destroy their black belt competitors. Surely given that skill set you would expect to see a black, brown, or purple if not destroy a blue belt beat them on skill and experience alone. Sure there maybe a few exceptions to that rule but for the most part that is what you would see.
You include all the afore mentioned belt ranks in these types of tournaments to find out how you would do against other people off the same belt rank. Can you imagine what mental game that would play on you if for example there were no belt ranks and your first match was against a seasoned black belt.
The way the Pan Ams and other such tournaments are set up are so that you as a competitior can compete on a fair playing field. I'm not saying you would win your division but you stand a better chance of winning your division than you would of a higher belt rank division. Last but not least by having seperate weight classes you allow more competitors to compete.
I would say that if you won your division you deserve to be a world champion due to the fact that the competition itself is about awarding 1st place winners with that title.
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